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High-Low-Split Poker, Seven-Card Stud and Omaha Eight-or-better for Advan (Advance Player)

Description

High-Low-Split Poker, Seven-Card Stud and Omaha Eight-or-Better For Advanced Players by Ray Zee is the third book in the "For Advanced Players" series. It is really books 3 and 4 for two reasons. First, many of the concepts are similar for both games. Second, players mastering one game can easily make the transition to the other.

Some of the ideas discussed in the seven-card stud eight-or-better section include starting hands, when an ace raises, disguising your hand on third street, play on fourth street, fifth street, sixth street, seventh street, position, bluffing, staying to the end, and scare cards. Some of the ideas discussed in the Omaha eight-or-better section include general concepts, position, low hands, high hands, your starting hand, how to play your hand, play on the flop, multiway versus short handed play, scare cards, getting counterfeited, and your playing style.

Reviews

Rating: 4 / 5
Date: 2009-03-19
Summary: "Two books for the price of one! But only one good book."

The Stud Hi/Lo split section is very specific, and very enlightening. It is definitely a section that I would not want my opponents to read. Many specific situations are covered, and the logic behind the actions he recommends is clear. It's clearly superior to any advice I've previously read on the topic.

The Omaha section is only okay. The Super/System 2 section is better, and "Winning Omaha 8 or Better" by Mark Tenner is best. Ray Zee seems to just kind of pull percentages out of thin air when discussing Omaha/8 strategy (one section discussing redraws is just ridiculous), and kind of falls into the trap that pre-flop raising is just silly in O8. However, the advice isn't as fallacious as some that I've seen on the internet (i.e. Full Tilt's ridiculous propagation of Matusow's "live high cards" blunder)

Overall, totally worth the time, especially if you don't feel like tracking down a separate book on O8.

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Rating: 4 / 5
Date: 2009-02-02
Summary: "Great for Learning, Fuzzy in Spots"

After a local tournament I had played in, I noticed a cash game started playing Omaha Hi/Lo. Naturally I played and had little success, barely managing to break even. I knew there was a way to beat this game so I ordered the book. Ray lays out a great basic strategy with tips for when to get in multi-way pots, when to play certain hands, etc. However, on the re-read, I found that a lot of the information was fuzzy; that is, it wasn't nearly specific or in-depth enough to carry you past the beginner or lower-intermediate level. The "For Advanced Players" tag is slightly misleading in that respect. However, it's a great book to get started.

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Rating: 4 / 5
Date: 2007-08-04
Summary: "Good stuff"

There are no good books out there on how to play Omaha 8 or better. The closest to good books are this one and Todd Brunsons section in SuperSystem. This covers enough to get you rolling and gives good principles on play, as opposed to specific advice.

Definitely worth getting if you're going to play split pot games.

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Rating: 5 / 5
Date: 2006-05-29
Summary: "east to understand"

this book is like no other 2+2 book~ its well edited.
having been a seven card stud h/l play for 7 years my game started to have leaks, this book plugged them.

if you are wanted to learn stud hi/lo read todd brunsons chapter in SS2 play and then pick up this book.

the omaha hi/lo section is not bad, still is missing something but one of the better book writen on the subject.

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Rating: 4 / 5
Date: 2006-05-18
Summary: "Typical 2+2 book: thought-provoking, but a little short on hard data"

I originally bought this 'cause I've been playing seven-card stud and was curious about Stud/8, but reading the Omaha/8 section motivated me into learning it first.

I've read most of the relevant 2+2 Publishing poker books (and some of the irrelevant ones) and this seems fairly typical of the genre. They don't tend to give specific advice about specific hands, but describe strategy in more general terms and help players to start asking the right questions.

The Stud/8 half is more comprehensive than the Omaha/8 half, but I feel both sections give pretty decent introductions to their respective games. While they don't, for example, list specific starting hands (a common complaint) I didn't have any trouble figuring out what to play; the beginning chapter in each section goes into the this in sufficient detail. They're "for advanced players" but I didn't have any trouble understanding any of them, and I'm most definitely a fishy newbie when it comes to poker.

I really appreciate the "question and answer" sections. The questions serve as helpful reminders, which is exactly what they're supposed to be. If there's a question you don't understand, it's easy to hop back to the relevant section in the main text and read in more detail what he's talking about.

My biggest issue, and it's a common problem with most of the 2+2 books, is the lack of basic information like hand probabilities. I find this surprising because of the emphasis placed in their books (Sklansky's Theory of Poker et al) on probability math in general and issues such as pot odds. If you don't know how likely it is your hand will hold up or what the chances are of, say, hitting a flush, it's nearly impossible to determine if you're getting enough of a return to make a call/bet worthwhile.

In general I think their books could be much better, but I must admit they're currently the most rigorous introduction to poker play I've been able to find. If you're just starting out with Stud/8 or Omaha/8, or you're an intermediate player looking for ways to improve, I think Ray Zee's book will be useful. If you're hoping for a "gentle" introduction to these games you're in the wrong place--and you might want to rethink your poker career, because poker isn't and never will be all that easy to learn.

Other suggestions: Bob Ciaffone's Omaha book has a practical section on Omaha/8, and I believe the latest version goes into it in even more detail. He's an excellent writer and his books are well worth checking out.

You might also try Tenner and Krieger, but I wasn't that impressed. Cappeletti's Omaha book is a jumbled mess, it gives me a headache just to look at it. The SS/2 section isn't awful, but can be summed up as: "always draw to the nuts, play good starting hands".